Tango Argentino > Group Lessons vs. Peer-to-Peer (P2P) Learning

Discussion in 'Tango Argentino' started by TomTango, Apr 14, 2017.

  1. itwillhappen

    itwillhappen Active Member

    Amazing - I as an intermediate lead calculate a few years to become a great lead! ;)

    Then I would assume that they simply passed the first tier and started with real learning in the second tier. Could you give some examples for such missions per tier?
    Bailamosdance likes this.
  2. ArbeeNYC

    ArbeeNYC Member

    You're an optimist. As one teacher said, in tango you're a beginner for the first 20 years.
    sixela likes this.
  3. TomTango

    TomTango Active Member

    That's about right. The first tier is designed for people who haven't really danced at all before. It has things like a mirror game to develop body awareness and introduce the concept of leader's intention. It has side-by-side walking. It introduces the concept of learning footwork by ending with a six-count box step in a practice hold.

    The theme of the second tier is ochos. It covers front ochos, back ochos, a simple parada, and ends with introducing the concept of improvisation and connecting movements together via a "tango sentence," Daniel Trenner-style.

    It's interesting that the curriculum doesn't introduce in-line walking until the 4th tier. The author argues that in-line walking takes so much balance and technique that students should develop some body awareness before attempting it. I have a few students who started learning tango in this learning lab. I'm interested to see how they handle walking compared to students who learn it in a first tango class.
  4. itwillhappen

    itwillhappen Active Member

    I wonder which music you play during the lessons, how steady and loud and present.
    And who brings some kind of relation and musicality into the proceedings on the floor.
  5. TomTango

    TomTango Active Member

    The music cycle has to last 15 minutes, so I've been doing 2 Canaro, 2 Calo, 1 electro tango, then a cortina for people to bring their attention back to the center. The electro tango lets people know to wrap up whatever concept they're working on.

    Musicality is probably the biggest weakness of this kind of teaching. I've been running traditional group lessons that focus on musicality in tandem with this peer to peer learning lab.
    itwillhappen likes this.
  6. nagamiki

    nagamiki New Member

    I think your experience of learning lead is natural and efficient. The only problem I am worrying is how to make an advanced follower accept our invitation and follow us honestly. In my city most advanced followers(and also intermediate followers maybe) are willing to dance with more advanced leaders and most of time only beginners will accept to dance with less skilled leaders. That's why I think P2P lessson may still valuable if we want to improve our leading skills.
  7. Chrisa Assis

    Chrisa Assis Member

    I think there is a lot changing now in terms of how people learn, compared to when I was learning to dance--ballet not tango--years back...haha
    The shift in my oponion came from our exposure to a lot more activities plus the internet and social behaviour patterns.
    So for us in the past, when you went in a class you listened what your teacher and did what they asked you do without contradicting them. You did it because they told you so... What that meant was that if you were not told to do the advanced version you wouldn't do it, if you were not asked to the higher level group you wouldn't go and if you had to repeat things a million times that is what you did...
    Now that has changed, for dance I think the great shift happened with contemporary dancing. Were the whole experience of the dance class is different. What you have there is themes to focus on and then a lot of feedback and experience sharing and then new attempts and then more sharing and endless back and forth where is you actively participate you grow in many different ways along with technically.
    And you can see that in martial arts for example with the teaching of Ido Portal... so this shift wasn't only in dance that is for sure...
    Now the big question is would this work in a Tango environment... I don't see why not. I am doing a group like that, it includes different levels of dancers and it follows exactly the pattern of contemporary a lot of doing and a lot of sharing. BUT, 2 key elements:
    1) I don't have absolute beginners--meaning people who have never danced Tango before
    2) It requires a different kind of work for me to provide with the right questions instead of the right answers. Plus to create an environment for people to start sharing--because that is often times something rather difficult.

    It is working out very smoothly... Now the big question is would it work for absolute beginners?
  8. Tango Distance

    Tango Distance Active Member

    My experience in Tango classes is people are very reluctant to give advice, even when directly asked for it. It is the opposite of Blues, where my experience is people are very willing to give unsolicited advice, especially to raw beginners. So FWIW I have seen it work in Blues classes. Maybe the Tango nonelephantine newbies will need some encouragement to give advice.
  9. itwillhappen

    itwillhappen Active Member

    Feel free to look for someone in your circle of friends that likes to teach you tango or even follow honestly. But if there is no such one - however - maybe you find that the whole commercial tango teaching infrastructure is a great achievement of modern times?
  10. Mladenac

    Mladenac Well-Known Member

    Advanced dancers automatically correct mistakes at a milonga. So there is not "honest" leading and following.
  11. newbie

    newbie Well-Known Member

    But in the context of a p2p class, even a not-so-advanced leader will besides the sequence, lead traps to check whether the advanced follower is honest. 'Just lead the sequence" is a sentence that we the learning leaders always heard at some point from a female teacher after she started to perform the sequence on her own instead of following our preparatory casual steps.
  12. Mladenac

    Mladenac Well-Known Member

    Sometimes that kind of following is beneficial, it can raise the energy, and release the stress on the leader.

    If a follower follows the everything leader lead it can be too stressful.

    I used professional sport's equipment and I know how it can be frustrating.
    When every mistake you make is so obvious. So sometimes less is more.
  13. itwillhappen

    itwillhappen Active Member

    I'm interested, too. :)
  14. ArbeeNYC

    ArbeeNYC Member

    I'm interested too. One fellow I know said he spent the first two years in tango just learning to walk.

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